Procyon Games

private sim

Thank you, thank you, thank you. I fully support every word you said.

The script-kiddies and heedless metaversal service agency myrmidons touting this resource hog are the usual suspects -- remember when Aimee Weber wanted "no push" to be an option adding another confusing slider to avatars themselves, rather than to the land?

I don't believe the mantra about "ban people, not grief tools" is at all sound. Please do a very thorough inventory and analysis of how these push commands are fact really, really used in SL such as to justify them. Um...the 17 elevators used in SL where people can...uh...fly? Now explain to me again why we need to put up with that crap?

Megaprims have absolutely no business on the mainland, whatever case you might make for them on islands. They are used far, far more for griefing than "good" uses and even "good" users constantly whack them around accidently griefing neighbours and lagging sims anyway. I simply don't allow them in my rentals because experience has shown me that they always end up harassing everybody else, even when not griefing per se, and they raise real questions about the resource issues and lag.

I don't see why I need to subsidize the careers of mega builders and griefers at the expense of what little CPU there is to go around in SL.

Prokofy Neva

mega prims are not the biggest contributor to sim lag. that award goes to one and only one LSL command and that would be llSleep. this command uses so many cycles that it's insane, it's 100 times laggier than a .1 second timer(get sim tools or a friend with them). the sad part is that it's used by 99% of scripters and to magnify the problem nearly the same number of scripters don't know that it's a problem.

as for using a large percent of resources. the most used megaprim is a cube which is one of the simplest calculations for physics stuff. so even if for some odd reason it does use more resources it would most likely be the same as a tortured prim.

as for arguments for removing megaprims from mainland I see no argument against it. people renting there already know that the land is heavily managed by LL.

however in the case of private sims LL should take a hands off approach if they do end up having any issues with them it's the sim owners problem not LL's.

Sorry, Rifkin, I'll have to part ways with you here.

No, I'm not Linden Lab. But we have done quite a lot of resource testing in Suffugium out of simple necessity; our various automatic systems (the police drones, cars wandering the streets, and interactive stuff all around) are rather resource-consuming.

It was our testing that first found that a script in an object that is idle but 'running' still consumes time on the scheduler. While I can hardly claim to have exhaustively tested every possible scenario, megaprims are no more resource intensive than a 'normal' prim of the same type... save only that they aren't culled.

This does not say "delete all megaprims" to me. This says, "fix the culling routine".

Mega prims take up no more resources than normal prims. In fact it uses the same. A prim is a collection of numbers Position, Size, Rotation and the various othe settings along with a referene to a texture (not the texture itself) and texture settings (so and so forth, whats avalilable in the build menu). That never changes, the amount of data that is processed is the same for a 36km2 prim as a 0.1m2 prim. These numbers are passed to the client. The client feeds these through some math routines to generate a mesh. (the 3D representation of the object) And again, the same number of triangles created regardless of the size of item. (at least with flat surfaces, it may be different with spheres and cylinders, but I don't think it is, as small spheres use for too many vertices for what they are).

The only potential resource problem with Megaprims is when the new havok4 system comes in, and thats due to the "collision islanding" it does. If someone put a sim-wide prim down, the new havok4 can't create little "islands" of objects in its memory structure to do less collisions as it would all be one big "collision island". And worse that does, is make Havok4 perform like Havok1 for a sim.

The resource hog that lags sims, are scripts, both those in rezzed items in the sim, and those worn by avatars.

And the number of prims affects performance too (a larger list to check through when trying to decide what to dish out to each avatar).

So infact megaprims help performance. "Less prims, less data, less data to pass on along the network, less data to feed through functions = greate performance".

I think the culling problem isn't so much of a problem. Really a megaprims culling takes place from the center of the prim so, like the sign on the mirror "objects may not be as close as they appear". A bigger problem with megaprims is that at low draw distance you may be too far away from the center point to see a mega that you are colliding with. Anyone who uses them for building soon enough discovers these things and works around them.

Megaprims take away the issue of high bandwidth requirements of rendering many many prims for a simple surface which, as your object increases in size, tends towards increasing the geometry requirements on the client and download bandwidth by a factor of six.

It's very easy to see this effect in say the greenies sim by poppin in there and watching how long it takes to render the entire wall/floor/roof surface as opposed to the kicker rails and other geometry in the area. Megas are a clear winner.

The only people who will find geometry lag by the use of megaprims are those who insist in seeing the maximum half kilometer draw distance in sl. Those folk are just asking for lag as they're expecting to be able to see up to 9 sims around them. When it comes to occlusion based on size megas are going to win hands down, which isn't such a bad thing considering they're... well... big.

I use mega prims. I don't use zero prim rezzers because I think they probably create more lag and also are more draining on resources. I'm not a prim capacity so it's not to squeeze every last drop out of the land I own. I own on main land because unless you own your own private island, there's no guarantee you will have more rights than you would on mainland. *shrugs* I could be wrong. Also I don't use mega prims as a mere resource saving exercise, I use them because of the ease of working with larger structures. I'd like to see some independent stats that contain data about the testing environment before I'm convinced they are good, bad or neutral. For now, they're convenient.

OK, This is BS. I love megaprims. They are the gold of SL

I believe what Chris says is acctually true (the BS part), first off, megaprims are about the least of the problems around SL so this kind of discussion is most very pointless due to the fact of the ammount of bugs in SL, which also means if megaprims are taken away then SL loses alot of sim buyers, also let me make it clear that with megaprims i think you will find the lag is less, however lag is used as an excuse but the main reason is infact the prims, which means people want sims with less prims *aaww*, however if people were not to use megaprims, then you will find walls and floors and ceilings with scabby black lines which brings noyment and also DOES cause more lag as SL is loading more than 1 prim for a wall, which means longer loading time, only reason i know this is because i've been behind the engineering of other games.

"Well, duh. There's a reason for the prim cap."

"Guess what? You have only yourself to blame."

"Excuse me, do you have the statistics on bandwidth utilization from Linden Lab?"

Thats no way to convince people of this matter.

If you have any proof, statistics, anything, please share, none of what you wrote makes in sence.